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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1980-11-04 - City Commission Special Meeting MinutesL�J 5811 NORTHWEST 88TH AVENUE 0 TAMARAC, FLORIDA 33321 TELEPHONE (305) 722-5900 October 28, 1980 NOTICE OF SPECIAL MEETING CITY COUNCIL TAMARAC, FLORIDA Please be advised of a Special Meeting of the City Council to be held on Tuesday, November 4, 1980 at 10:00 A.M. in the West Conference Room at City Hall. The purpose of the Meeting is to conduct Architect Negotiations for the addition to City Hall with the firm of Michael A. Shiff and Associates, Inc. Council may consider such other business as may come before it. The public is invited to attend. Pursuant to Chapter 80-150 of Florida Law, Senate Bill. No. 368: If a person decides to appeal any decision made by the City Council with respect to any matter considered at such Meeting, he will need a record of the proceedings, and for such purpose, he may need to ensure that a verbatim record of the proceedings is made, which record includes the testimony and evidence upon which the appeal is to be based. Carol A. Evans Assistant City Clerk /lc 10/28/80 CITY OF TAMARAC, FLORIDA SPECIAL CITY COUNCIL MEETING November 4, 1980 CALL TO ORDER: Mayor Falck called the meeting to order on Tuesday, November 44, 1980 at 10:00 A.M. in the West Council Chambers. ROLL CALL: PRESENT: Mayor Walter W. Falck Vice -Mayor Helen Massaro Councilman Irving M. Disraelly Councilman Irving Zemel Councilwoman Marjorie Kelch ALSO PRESENT: City Manager, Edward A. Gross City Attorney, Arthur M. Birken Mayor Falck read the notice of the special meeting to conduct Architect Negotiations for the addition to City Hall with the firm of Michael A. Shiff and Associates, Inc. _ 2. Discussion_an _ d possible action---. Northwood.._ LZ_._Tr1 .azt_..._.and Tract 36 Density. SYNOPSIS OF ACTION: Agendized by consent -- Preparation of a stipulation with H.L.R. subject to plat approval by the Count ---ate__ Stipulation approval by Judge Weissing. C/M Zemel MOVED to agendize on possible action Northwood II Tract 1 and Tract 36 density, and V/ M Massaro SECONDED the motion. VOTE: ALL VOTED AYE. City Attorney Arthur Birken indicated that two Council meetings ago Council first learned of a little hitch in the approval that was given for Tracts 1 and 36; the density for Tract 1 was interpreted by the City as being 11.77 units per acre and the question had been raised and interpreted originally by the property owner that the density should be at 15 units per acre and that affects the number of units which could be built in Tract 36. Mr. Birken further indicated that Tract 1 was platted and site - planned at less than the maximum permitted and there was a desire to transfer from Tract 1 to Tract 36, 61 units,,figuring at 11.77 units per acre there was a shortfall of 25 units. This matter was discussed at the last Council meeting and tabled and is being discussed today because the County Commission has the plat of Tract 36 on its agenda today. Chairman Forman has stated that this will be brought up at 2:00 this afternoon. Mr. Birken said the City Council did approve the plat and site plan for Tract 1 and Tract 36 as presented with 25 units each; Council is most anxious to see that the developer is not penalized because of an action the City was involved with. He said the solution proposed should not establish any adverse precedent for the City and if Council agrees, take a portion of the existing density that would be distributed to Tract 36, which is zoned R-3,and under R-3 zoning even at 11.77 units per acre, there ........... should be far in excess of the number of units that are requested. The City could enter into a stipulation with HLR to the effect that the density for that one tract would be 61 units, more than is provided for in the court order at the time and that we would take away the extra units from Tract 1 which was 36 at 11.77 units per acre and do this on the basis of density. The City Attorney said the 25 units would be coming out of units that were built or platted within Tracts 4, 5 and 6 already at lower than the density provided under the court orders. -1- November 4, 1980 /pe L L�J Mr. Birken went on to say that as Council is aware, most of the Montwood Tracts have come in substantially less than the court orders if the question was raised as to where those 25 units would come from by the County Commission. He said - what is being requested is authority to enter into a stipula- tion that would give certain credit to Tract 36 at current zoning and that this stipulation be submitted to Judge Weissing for approval. Mr. Birken said he has spoken with representatives of the County Attorney's office and they do not appear to have any problem with this approach and that the City is concerned with avoiding setting a precedent as is the County and it appeared that this approach would be the acceptable solution to the County if acceptable to the City Council. V/M Massaro indicated that there are some 700 plus paper units within Land Section 4, 5 and 6 that were not used under the court order. Mayor Falck said it would be his suggestion that Council agree to authorize the issuance of the stipulation. Mr. Victor de Sousa representing HLR indicated that Mr. Rubin is now at the County awaiting the outcome of this meeting in order to proceed with the matter which has been postponed until 2:00 P.M. He said if the City approvesproceeding with this stipulation, he asks that the City inform the County Commission today to see if they can get the plat approved subject to the stipulation being approved by the court. _. _.. --- - ----- Mayor-Falck expressed his opinion that V/M Massaro and the City Attorney should be in attendance at the meeting this afternoon. Birken said he anr1_-_t_4e_.u.i.ce _Ma-ao.r . old. be there -as - _re.nres-e-ntativ-es _. Mr. Victor de Sousa stated that without going into detail, the solution that Mr. Birken put forward, is the solution that serves all purposes without creating any problems to anybody. V/M Massaro asked if this is approved subject to a stipulation, would the stipulation further by approved by Council, and Mayor Falck replied yes. V/M Massaro MOVED that the Council accepts and authorizes the preparation of a stipulation between the City and HLR for Tracts 1 and 36 which would state that the density for Tract 36 would be computed by looking at current zoning for that Tract with the maximum number of 61 additional units and that the density for Tract 1 would be reduced to the number of units that are shown on the approved site plan, 221 units total on Tract 36 and 1.71 units total on Tract 1 and that the City Council is approving the new density subject only to the appropriate language being agreed upon at a subsequent City Council meeting, also subject to the approval of the..Plat by the County -and.- approval of stipulation by the judge. Mr. Birken replied to a question by Mr. de Sousa and explained if the County Commissioner does not approve them, the City Council needs to come back and decide what it wants to do. C/W Kelch SECONDED the motion. VOTE: ALL VOTED AYE. Mayor Falck excused C/M zemel. 1.Architect Negotiations for the addition to City Hall SYNOPSIS OF ACTION: Tabled until next regular meeting. -2- November 4, 1980 . /pe Mayor Falck stated that the purpose negotiate with Michael A. Shiff and Council's first choice in connection addition to City Hall. of the meeting is to Associates, Inc., the with the proposed C/M Disraelly wanted to know what would happen if two years from now we built a new City Hall; what effect would that open space have on our ability to sell the building since the windows and fins would not be removed and wouldn't the value of the building be decreased as to marketing and use of this building destroyed in many respects. C/M Disraelly suggests that we put up with the shortage of space for another one or two years and that we should give greater consideration to asking someone to design a new building, at which point we go to grant or by some other means, so that each of the departments will have the space they need and we can adequately work within the City instead of putting ourselves in the posture where we will have a nothing building here :and difficulty in selling this building and making this a worthless edifice. V/M Massaro agreed with C/M Disraelly and further felt that with the exception of the Police Department, we could get along with the space we have and that we should be thinking about the whole picture rather than filling in that space which the City might not be happy about. C/M Zemel returned to the meeting, and agreed that ,-in addition to the City Hall might interfere with what the City may want to do in the future. He said perhaps Council should think about a rented trailer. C/M Disraelly said he would much rather pursue the thought of an architect preparing plans for a new City Hall, and feels we would be better off if we live with the space we now have and perhaps entertain the thought of renting a trailer. Mr. Gross stated that he believes City Hall is overcrowded and that we need additional space, not only in the Police Depart- ment, but in most departments and thinks we are wrong in thinking that the building will deteriorate, as an architect can draw up a pleasant addition to the building and the value of the building will be increased. He said the important thing is if the City does want to go ahead and build a larger facility someplace else, it will be 3 or 4 years away and we would have a referendum to worry about and have a problem with space more and more. Mr. Gross indicated that he felt a trailer would not do and feels the City could rent space someplace else, although this will be expensive. C/M Disraelly asked Mr. Shiff if 3200 sq. ft. w as going to be provided and Mr. Shiff indicated that it would be about 1600 sq. ft. for each floor, or 3200 sq. ft. for two floors and 4800 sq. ft. for three floors. C/M Disraelly questioned Mr. Gross as to who will get the space and where each department will be and which department is going to use what space. (tape side #2) Mr. Gross replied that we already have the information as to the amount of space each department requires, but Council has not discussed this with the architect because at the present time, it may be voted down and feels it is too early to do that. Mr. _...__.es stated-- tha-t --- i-rr the initial plans after the architects is hired, he can then tell us what walls can or cannot be taken out. V/M Massaro asked if the City draftsmen or City Engineer could :'.'takc a rough sketch of what could be done. =15 November 4, 1980 /pe C/M Disraelly indicated to Mr. Gross that he has to tell the architect how much space will be needed, and Mr. Gross said that he has been given that information. Mr. Shiff explained that in bigger projects, sometimes a programmer will come in and figure out how to utilize the space and in smaller projects, the architect can advise how that space is to be used. C/M Disraelly would like to know what departments will fill in the 3200 sq. ft. Mr. Shiff discussed the fact that the City may be going to referendum to build this City Hall and V/M Massaro indicated Council is not thinking about that now, but are going to try to get grants to build City Hall and that will be investigated. Mayor Falck expressed his thoughts in that he is not concerned about what modifications will be done to the building and what effect it would have on the building, but that the reason the City selected.Mike Shiff & Associates was that they came up with an observation as to how it could be done and that it would not detract from the building. He also indicated that he thought it would be about 5 years before a new City Hall could be built and that the City would have to go to a referendum even with a grant. Mayor Falck said the least we can do is to afford our people the facilities in which to work and that we cannot seek people to do things for us and the people of the City and not give them a place to work. C/M Disraelly asked if anyone thought about the possibility of putting a folding door across the middle of Council Chambers and make two or three rooms out of the existing space and Mr. Gross indicated that this has already been taken up. Mayor Falck said he has no objection as to what .can -he done t4 modify the space, as it is a number one problem. C/W Kelch indicated that this still does not solve the problem of crowding within the departments and she feels we should listen to what the architects said, as they felt it was a feasible plan and would not destroy the building. V/M Massaro asked why a rough sketch hasn't been done, so Council could see exactly what would go where. Mr. Robert Savers of Michael Shiff & Associates indicated that he wanted to respond to a question that was asked of him as to the last meeting as to whether they thought it seemed to be a feasible concept to enclose that space and their response was after a previous examination of the building, that it was a feasible plan, but spacial need was not indicated to them at that time. He said his background includes a lot of programming and there are two ways to identify that program; one,is that you sit down with people who are involved in the work and inter- view people and directors and ask them what spacial need is required, and two.very frequently when you add on space, this space isn't used wisely and territories should be reidentified so that spacial needs are determined. He also said that the 3200 sq. ft. needs to be programmed and see how internal spaces could function, as well as utilizing partitions and dividing work space. C/M Disraelly asked if Mr. Shiff agreed with him that the archi- tects have to know who is going to go where, and Mr. Shiff indicated that this is one of the reasons they are hired, to determine what space is needed where. Mr.Sayers mentioned that Mr. Gross has already determined that there is a need for 3200 sq. ft. or more, but how that internal space should be sub -divided has not been determined. -4- November 4, 1980 /pe -A C/M Disraelly said he thinks the space should be sub -divided before building and that instead of fitting what is left into the 3200 sq. ft.; do we need 3200 sq. ft. or 5000 sq. ft. Mr. Shiff said the City probably needs much more than 3200 sq. ft., but you can only build so much with the monies the City is allowed to spend and being that he is not familiar with the internal workings of the City and if the City has to wait for a grant, that might take a long time. V/M Massaro said the elections may determine what grants will be let and Mr. Shiff indicated that if the EDA Program happens, it happens very fast. C/M Disraelly said that we should design a new building and then when a grant comes along, we go ahead and build, and he indicated that he would rather use a portion of this money for the design of the building. Mr. Shiff reported that they can enclose two floors at least and give the City space that can be utilized within the budget, but he can't determine if that is the proper move for the City. He mentioned that the windows will be blocked and that might hurt the sale of this building. Mr. Savers asked if the City has seen the Police facility separated from the municipal complex, or part of it,__ and the Mayor indicated that this had never been decided. Mr.Sayres stated that if the Police Department can operate separately, then the building program can be reached more quickly. He said there are LEA funds that are now available for both programming and some moderate construction dollars and if perhaps City Hall is five years in the future, a Police Department,might only be 2 to 3 years away, freeing up that space. Mr. Shiff discussed what other cities are doing in regard to their Police Departments and V/M Massaro said the Police Department can be in the same complex if not in the same building. Mr. Sayers indicated that the Pompano Beach Police Department is going to be built in a separate.facility and that LEA and the Association of Police Chiefs in their planning have determined and are trying to impact grants on that premise; that Police facilities work and operate best separated from the municipal complex primarily because of security and acts of terrorism. V/M Massaro said it is dangerous here with all sorts of people waiting downstairs. C/W Kelch asked if the Police Department was moved to a separate building, would we have enough space here and Mr. Gross replied that the Police use 25t of the existing facilities; C/M Disraelly further indicating that the present Police Department uses 2900 square feet, including circulation. C/M Disraelly said that the proposed police facility was supposed to be approximately 8500 sq. ft. at least and the present size of this building is only 1.3,000 sq. ft. and that 10,000 sq. ft. is the only usable space that is inside this building. He further indicated that the proposed allocation of space made two years ago for City Hall showed an excess of 25,000 sq. ft. excluding police facilities. Mayor Falck indicated that he thought this should be tabled until we resolve other things. C/M Disraelly said that Council should discuss the input that Mr. S.aye�s and Mr. Shiff have given Council. -5- November 4, 1980 /pe r V/M Massaro MOVED that this item be tabled and we consider and prepare some definite thoughts about this building or do we want to simply be prepared at the next meeting to discuss whether we want to start talking about a City Hall complex or going to bid for an architect for a City Hall complex. Mr.Shiff explained that if they were to spend money for analyzation and programming to determine special needs on a statistical basis, whether the City augpentedt this program or not, this would be utilized at a later date. V/M Massaro said that Council will have to do some heavy thinking and can then ask the City Manager to provide us with whatever information that is needed. Mayor Falck indicated that we need to have a master plan because we do not know what we will do with this building and we need to know how we are going to develop the area and in what stages we are going to proceed. The Mayor mentioned the Frank Veltri Building and feel they did a marvelous job on utilizing the space but that we haven't decided that or even where we are going to locate. a new building. Arthur Birken, City Attorney said that if the City has an architect for a City Hall complex, the City would have to go out for bids. Mayor Falck indicated that if the City stays with this, advertising will not be necessary. Mr. Shiff said he thought the City needed help with the master plan, and if the City wanted to use their services, it would not exceed $5000.00, but they would need to meet with all department heads and the City Manager to find out about existing space and projected needs for the City including the Police Department; they will look at the buildings the City owns, look at the Public Works Building, look at the land the City owns and that will be acquired, and then they can tell the City what is needed now and in the future and give some projections that the Capital Improve- ment Plan can be based on. He felt that LEA funds may be avail- able and thinks it can be done for $5000.00. C/W Kelch stated that she thinks Council should go with this. Mr.Sayres..indicated that they could do.a gross plan, but couldn't design City Hall for that amount of money, but will determine what department needs what. V/M Massaro asked if their proposal would include a sketch and Mr. Shiff replied that it would be just a sketch for illustrative purposes, but not a design for City Hall; it might be some site studies, but not a sketch for that money. Mr. Gross said if it is at all possible legally, he feels Council should go ahead and asked if they can have a proposal for Council at the next meeting, and it can be put on the agenda. Mr. Shiff replied that they will have it ready for the next meeting. C/W Kelch SECONDED the motion. VOTE: ALL VOTED AYE. The meeting was adjourned at ATTEST: ASST. CIT CLERK 11: 0 A. . C'�'J �AY R __J This public document was promulgated at a cost of $69.38 or $2.77 per copy to inform the general public and public officers and employees about recent opinions and considerations by the City Council of the City of Tamarac, Florida. APPROVE BY CI COUNCI ON a� /98 D November 4, 1980 - 6 - .� A