HomeMy WebLinkAbout1985-07-16 - City Commission Committee Meeting Minutes (2)CITY OF TAMARAC, FLORIDA
COMMITTEE MEETING
REGARDING THE MUNICIPAL COMPLEX
July 16, 1985 *REVISED 8/12/85
Tape 1 CALL -TO -ORDER: V/M Massaro called the meeting to order on
Tuesday, July 16, 1985 at 10:00 A.M. in the Council Chambers of
City Hall.
EQLLSALL: PRESENT:
Vice Mayor Helen Massaro
Councilman Arthur H. Gottesman
Councilman Sydney M. Stein
ALSO PRESENT
Larry Perretti, Acting City Manager
Jon M. Henning, City Attorney
Bob Jahn, Chief Building Official
Richard Rubin, Consultant Planner
Patricia Marcurio, Secretary
V/M Massaro corrected the notice of the meeting which stated that
this was a "Workshop Session regarding the Municipal Complex".
She said this is not a Workshop Session but a Committee Meeting.
She then read the notice of the Committee Meeting into the
record.
* V/M Massaro said C/M Gottesman is the Council liaison for the Municipal
Complex and commended him on the work he has done concerning the municipal
complex. Mr. Henning said this Committee Meeting is to set some guidelines
for the scheduled meeting with the architects this afternoon at 1:00 P.M.
He said the purpose of this meeting is to address the floor plan more than
the site plan since the site plan is progressing. V/M Massaro said
discussion should concern how the floorplan can be corrected.
At this po int in the meeting, there were drawings
of the proposed municipal complex as well as a model displayed on
the table for viewing by those present.
C/M Gottesman said the first floor of the building is slightly
larger than the second floor and the areas colored in blue on the
model are a thick, translucent material which is a costly item.
He said while the theory of this building is cosmetically beauti-
ful, it is not functional. He said no thought has been given to
which areas of the building have the most traffic such as the
Planning, Personnel or City Clerk's Departments.
V/M Massaro said the City cannot spend the amount of money
allocated for this since there are too many things that are not
included, therefore, this must be cut somehow.
C/M Gottesman said he would like to eliminate the atrium, which
is an area on the first floor with an open space and tile floor
and is expensive to construct. He said this atrium also includes
planters and from a maintenance and construction standpoint, it
is very costly. He said instead of trying to squeeze the
building together, the building could remain the same but the
last two bays could be removed. He said there are approximately
between 6,000 and 10,000 square feet allocated for this atrium
and this could be utilized as functional space. He said if two
bays were cut off, approximately 50-feet by 130-feet, the space
that was planned for those offices could be used in the space of
the atrium area.
C/M Gottesman said the plans call for glass for the interior
walls of the building so that the Department Heads can look out
onto the atrium.
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C/M Gottesman suggested the glass interior walls be eliminated as
well. He said he discussed this with the Fire Department and
they feel it might not be approved as it is. He said the
problems include the standpipes and the fact that some of the
stairways are hidden. Mr. Henning said these suggestions would
keep the same amount of office space but have less aesthetics in
the middle and C/M Gottesman agreed.
Mr. Rubin said at the original programming stage, the architect
said that when the City is built out at 75,000 people, the
maximum size of the building should be 36,300 square feet. He
said this building is 46,400 square feet. He said by removing
those two bays, this would bring the size back to the original
recommendation. Mr. Henning said the building will not be made
any narrower and he questioned if the general configuration of
the departments in relation to each other is agreeable to every-
one. He said it might be better to just squeeze the building
together and maintain the overall schematics.
C/M Gottesman said the building as planned is 200-feet long and
he suggested the same width be kept with the offices on the
outside and the middle space be used for the elevators.
Mr. Jahn said the size in square feet does not always determine
the cost of the building, it is what is inside and how it is done
that determines the cost. He said reducing the square footage
might not be the ultimate savings. He said if plans are going to
be changed, it is the structural construction in the square
footage that saves money. He said if the atrium is going to be
removed and a normal size corridor planned, then the span of the
structural members would have to be changed.
Mr. Henning said he understands that if the integrity of the
building is maintained and the perimeter is moved together, then
the plumbing, electrical, etc. would be the same. C/M Gottesman
said the layout itself is not good and should be reorganized. He
said another item that might reduce the cost would be a flat
roof.
V/M Massaro said it should be determined how things will be
rearranged. Mr. Perretti said all of the service departments
should be on the first floor with the Personnel Department by the
entrance so that the public has the least access in and out of
the building. He said the entrance way should have a reception-
ist who would also collect the utility bills. V/M Massaro said
the Utility Office for billing was supposed to be incorporated
and Mr. Perretti said that was done but is planned for the second
floor. He said also close to the entrance should be the Building
Department which is now planned for the second floor.
Mr. Henning said the entire half of the first floor is planned
for the Finance Department, Utilities, Accounting, computers,
etc. and that takes up half the bottom floor. Mr. Perretti said
the Finance Department should have no traffic from the public.
Mr. Henning said there is a question as to whether the computer
equipment can be placed on the second floor. C/M Gottesman
noted that the elevator is not sufficiently large for its loca-
tion. Mr. Henning said the Finance Department could have
everything upstairs with just a billing office on the first
floor. He noted that presently the Council offices are planned
for the first floor adjacent to the City Clerk's office and he
suggested this might be moved to the second floor.
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Tape 2
V/M Massaro noted that it depends on how much space is needed for
the service offices. C/M Gottesman said he would like to see a
way for the Council to get to the Chambers without going outside
of the building. He suggested the mechanical equipment such as
transformers, etc. be put in the back of the building.
Mr. Henning said presently the first floor has the Finance
Department on one entire side and this should be put on the
second floor. He said the Engineering and Community Development,
which is planned presently for the second floor, should be
brought to the first floor. V/M Massaro noted that the City
Clerk's office should be downstairs to handle the public who come
in for Occupational Licenses. Mr. Rubin noted that the Building,
Engineering and the City Clerk's Departments should be on the
first floor. Mr. Perretti noted that a great deal of the traffic
that goes into the City Clerk's office concerns the copying
machine and he suggested there be a separate room just for this
purpose. C/M Stein said the copying and the licenses should be
downstairs with the rest of the City Clerk's office upstairs.
V/M Massaro asked Mr. Perretti if there is a problem concerning
computers being maintained with a certain temperature and he said
yes. He said when the Cody Study was made, they suggested
separating the computer area from the Finance Department to allow
it to be more versatile than just doing Finance work.
V/M Massaro asked why it was kept in the Finance Department and
Mr. Henning said it was just traditional. Mr. Jahn said the
equipment can be remote from the terminals and readily accessible
for everyone.
C/M Gottesman said one of the lounges planned has the toilets in
the lounge and there are Code problems. V/M Massaro suggested
Mr. Perretti itemize what he feels should be located on the first
floor so that an agenda could be prepared for the afternoon
meeting with the architects on this subject.
Mr. Perretti suggested the following be on the first floor:
1. A reception area in the center of the entrance for acceptance
of utility bills.
2. Personnel, Building, Community Development and Engineering
Departments.
3. The center area, presently planned for the atrium, could be
utilized as a Xerox -copy machine area for all offices.
4. A large freight elevator at the back of the building.
5. The City Clerk's office should be close to the Council
Chambers.
6. Occupational Licensing should be on the first floor.
7. The Charter Board should be upstairs.
8. The Finance Department would be on the second floor.
C/M Gottesman questioned whether 36,000 square feet is needed for
the City Hall and V/M Massaro said that is estimated for a full
buildout of 75,000 population.
Mr. Jahn asked whether the architects will be responsible for the
changes to the drawings and V/M Massaro said they will have to
pay for it since the plans grew under their auspices.
V/M Massaro asked Mr. Rubin if he has any suggestions and he said
from a functional standpoint, it makes sense to have the Finance,
City Manager, Council and the Charter Board upstairs. He sug-
gested the Chambers be internally accessed as well.
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C/M Gottesman said the architects should provide items in the
restrooms that are better than just minimum City Code. He said
it has been agreed by everyone present that these floor plans do
require practically a complete redesign.
Mr. Jahn said it should be noted that if the atrium concept is
removed, a flat roof could be considered. V/M Massaro said she
is uncertain if a flat roof is a good idea. C/M Stein said there
could still be a peaked roof without it being 40-feet wide.
Mr. Rubin noted that the architect will probably state that if
the roof is sloped, the theme will be changed.
C/M Stein suggested the concept should be changed with the
materials and the width. V/M Massaro said there should be enough
pitch in the roof to avoid valleys in the roof. C/M Gottesman
said the outside finish of the building has not been discussed
and V/M Massaro said she would like to see stone put on the
building to avoid maintenance problems. C/M Gottesman agreed
that the plain stucco has no character and is a maintenance
problem.
V/M Massaro said she would like to see this type of permanent
stone put on the interior walls as well and C/M Gottesman said he
saw plans that called for wallpaper. V/M Massaro said that would
be difficult to maintain in good condition and suggested rugs be
considered for the walls.
Mr. Henning said if the existing plan is used with the circular
back area, he questioned whether it was possible to have a
hallway there to allow a doorway and a ramp. C/M Gottesman
suggested that there be a way for Council to leave the dais and
go back to their offices without going through the public areas.
He said there should be a lounge provided in that area with a
telephone, table, chairs and perhaps coffee facilities.
Mr. Jahn said another suggestion would be a room that is isolated
from the Chambers itself but with a loud speaking system for the
press with telephones. Mr. Rubin said this should have glass
walls as well. Mr. Henning suggested there be two or three
telephones behind the dais to be able to call staff when
necessary.
C/M Gottesman said the driveway proposed is for two-way traffic
and is only 25-feet wide. Mr. Henning said this would be the
function of the site plan to require more footage. Mr. Rubin
said the architect submitted two or three more site plans and he
suggested reviewing them today. C/M Gottesman said the site plan
could be considered because changes would not necessarily change
that.
V/M Massaro questioned the size of the area provided for parking
and Mr. Henning said originally they were accused of having a
footprint that was too small and it appears they have given more
area for footprint even though their sketched in area is not any
bigger. Mr. Rubin said the plan they were reviewing does not
work because there is no slope of the canal bank.
Mr. Rubin referred to the site plan called "Scheme A" and said
the relationship to the buildings is the same. He said the City
Hall is more free standing on this site plan. He suggested this
Committee determine which site plan is most functional.
V/M Massaro said the ponds should be eliminated and the Police
Department should be near the Fire Department. C/M Gottesman
said he feels there is little cost involved in the ponds and
V/M Massaro said there is much cost later and they could become
problem areas. She said it would be better to landscape that
beautifully.
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Mr. Rubin referred to the site plan called "Scheme C" and said
there is a lot of public parking directly opposite the Council
Chambers and the Police Station. He said of all three alterna-
tives this shows the smallest area for the Community Center.
He said the site on the south will be zoned commercial in the
future and the City could have them provide the City with access
so that there would be another way to leave the site. He said
the berm would have to start 20-feet from the waterline of the
canal and go up another 20-feet. He said that would require 45
to 50-feet there and he suggested the architect consider this.
C/M Stein said the Committee members agree that they prefer
"Scheme C". Mr. Rubin asked if this should be put on the Plan-
ning Commission Agenda for tomorrow and C/M Gottesman said that
would be best. C/M Gottesman asked Mrs. Bochenek if the
Beautification Committee would like to meet to discuss this and
she said she could call a Special Meeting if necessary.
Mr. Jahn said it is possible that the architects might cancel the
contract when they learn of all the changes that have been
proposed. The Committee said they are not concerned about that.
V/M Massaro said Miller & Meier is too responsible a firm to do
that.
C/M Gottesman suggested the Committee review the plans for the
Police Department. V/M Massaro said there does not seem to be
much of a problem with the internal plans for the Police Station
but the big problem is the overall cost and the things that have
not been included that are needed that will bring the cost beyond
the 8 million dollars.
Mr. Rubin reviewed the plan with the Committee noting that it
includes: the lobby, the receptionist area, the Detective Bureau,
an open courtyard around the building, a training area, a gym, a
locker room for men and women, a roll call room, a property
division area, a detention area with 8 cells and an administra-
tive area for the Police Chief.
V/M Massaro asked if it is because of lack of facilities that
prisoners are not kept overnight presently or because of a law of
the County. Mr. Henning said the Sheriff runs the detention area
and the 9*2 are just holding cells until the Sheriff picks the
prisoners;up, which is usually once or twice a day. V/M Massaro
Tape 3 asked-why_8 cells are planned then and Mr. Henning said because
there are men, women and juveniles which must all be kept separ-
ately.
Mr. Rubin said this plan also shows a sally port where prisoners
are left off, which is a garage which has doors on both sides.
Mr. Rubin said over the roofed area there is storage area for
bicycles, auto parts, etc. He said it should be shown whether
the sally port is locked. The Committee agreed that perhaps
gates would be better than garage doors.
V/M Massaro asked what type of exits are planned there to make
the Police Station accessible to the Fire Department and
Mr. Rubin said it is shown on the plan. He said all the working
drawings have to be redone because the architect put it on the
site plan the same way he drew it but the three electrical and
mechanical towers are facing 88 Ave. He said this is a major
change.
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C/M Stein said they have estimated $250,000 for communications
equipment and V/M Massaro said this amount is wrong and the
realistic figure is a minimum of $600,000 to 1 million dollars.
She said the Chief said they need some hand equipment to go with
the communication system which costs approximately $2,100 each
and they need 70. She said Miller & Meier is planning the
Boynton Beach City Hall and they estimate the communications
system alone there will cost between 1 and 1-1/2 million dollars.
She said Boynton Beach has approximately the same number of
population.
Mr. Rubin said the architects should be told clearly that the
building will be built in just one phase. He said the original
estimate for the size of the Police Station was 20,000 square
feet and this building is 25,400 square feet or 20% larger.
C/M Stein suggested that the Police Chief be present at the
Committee Meeting scheduled for 1:00 P.M. this afternoon.
Mr. Rubin suggested the following agenda be followed at the
afternoon Committee Meeting:
1. Discussion of site plan -- Scheme C
2. City Hall Complex - Reduction of building size to original
36,000 square feet -- functional relationship
3. Auditorium
4. Police Department - Discussion of:
a) Communications System
b) Size of building
5. The next meeting with Miller & Meier before Council's August
Recess.
Mr. Henning said concerning Police radios, there is a requirement
that if a radio frequency is reserved, then a certain amount of
radios must be purchased to show that the frequency is being
used.
V/M Massaro adjourned the meeting at 12:00 P.M.
ASSISTANT CITY CLERK
This document was promulgated at a cost of $80.60 or $3.50
per copy to inform the general public and public officers and
employees about recent opinions and considerations by the City
Council of the City of Tamarac.
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