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Home My WebLink About1991-04-25 - City Commission Joint Workshop Meeting Minutes@x- ۥh �y �fx 0 x 0 0 x0 x0 x0 x0 x �- x� xA �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y �y4 �y �y �yC ity Council and �> x> x> x> x> xV xl x Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 1 CITY OF TAMARAC CITY COUNCIL AND CHARTER BOARD JOINT WORKSHOP MEETING THURSDAY, APRIL 25, 1991 CALL TO ORDER : Mayor Abramowitz called this meeting to Order on Thursday, April 25, 1991 at 10:00 a.m. in Conference Room #l of City Hall. PRESENT : Mayor Norman Abramowitz Vice-Mayor Dr. H. Larry Bender Councilman Henry Schumann Councilman Irving Katz Councilwoman Diane Glasser Muriel Davis, Chairwoman of the Charter Board Judy Kitograd, Vice-Chairwoman of the Charter Board Morton Winter, Charter Board David Krantz, Charter Board Isaac "Zeke" Feldman, Charter Board ALSO PRESENT : John P. Kelly, City Manager Karen Jackson, Secretary Mayor Abramowitz said the purpose of this meeting was to acquaint the new members of the City Council with the new members of the Charter Board and discuss various articles important to both. Mayor Abramowitz asked that the meeting be run as a Special Meeting. Mayor Abramowitz said he would like everyone to have the ability to say what they wish to say and he started with Muriel Davis, Charter Board Chairwoman. Chairwoman Davis said she felt the purpose of the Meeting is to discuss general and mutual concerns of the Charter Board and the Council and the Charter Board functions, in particular. Chairwoman Davis indicated that previous Councils wished to abolish the Charter Board and to eliminate some duties. She said the relationship between the two was not good. Chairwoman Davis said the Charter Board knows the City Council is the one legislative body in the City. She said the Charter Board does have specific functions identified in the City Charter. Chairwoman Davis said the Charter Board was concerned with the expenditures made by the City Council and another procedure should be developed to handle them. She said what is allowable should be clarified. Chairwoman Davis said one function of the Charter Board not utilized is Special Studies. She said she feels this can be used and will benefit the City. Mr. Krantz said he was quite concerned with referendums and indicated in the past the Charter Board had the sole authority to put a referendum before the voters. He said this was changed and now it is a joint decision between Council and the Charter Board. Mr. Krantz said his main concern now is what is the procedure for putting referendums on the ballot for the voters. He said his concern was the status of the Charter Board in relation to the rest of the City. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 2 Mr. Krantz said the Charter Board's members are elected by the residents and they should be recognized and the attitude of the City corrected. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd stated that all Members who spoke before her have the same concerns as she has. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said she felt this attitude started almost at the top, from the City Council. She said much has to be done by Council to initiate the respect and recognition to be given to the Charter Board. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said her concern is the failure of the City Council to share with the Charter Board more workings of the things going on in the City. She said many problems could have been eliminated if there were not so many secrets. She said the Charter Board does not wish to make policy or legislate but what it does want is to get information of what is happening in the City. Mr. Feldman said his concern regards the Tam-A-Gram wherein he states there are violations involving the I.C.M.A. He said he believes the I.C.M.A. should not be under the "jurisdiction" of the City Manager. Councilman Schumann said he is in favor of direct communication between City Council and the Charter Board. He said in the past, there were questions asked of him and he did not know the answers. Vice-Mayor Bender stated there is a definite need for a Charter Board. He said the Charter Board should be adding to and purging its knowledge of the Charter. He said that information in the Charter has been superseded by the State and cannot be used. He said duplications should be eliminated. Vice-Mayor Bender said the Charter should be updated to the present date. He said many things have changed since the Charter was originally written. He referred to the expense account wherein 20 years ago, the figure of $2,000 was a great deal of money and now it is not. Councilman Katz said he believes with Vice-Mayor Bender, there are things that should be changed. He said he had requested an Attorney General Opinion (A.G.O.) on whether it was legal for a legislative body to subordinate their authority to a "lay redistricting committee". He said he does not believe it was the intent of the Charter when it was initiated a long time ago. Councilman Katz said things should be looked at and updated. He said whatever information is available to one should be available to all. Mayor Abramowitz said for the record that with exception of City Manager John P. Kelly, he is also a senior citizen. He said as far as respect is concerned, it has to be earned. He said it does not come with being elected to a particular office and there is a definite need for a Charter Board. He said he believes the Charter Board does not do what it says it will do. He said the lack of respect he sees is because the newspapers only seem to print negative comments. Mayor Abramowitz said that when the City Manager requested experts in the State of Florida to do a review of the Charter, the biggest problem the City had was with the Charter Board. He said the Board did not want anyone to infringe on their territory. Mayor Abramowitz said the meetings held were quite productive until it came down to who was the legislative body in the City of Tamarac. He said there cannot be two legislative bodies in the City. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 3 Mayor Abramowitz said in his past years with the Council, in meetings with the Charter Board, the Council never agreed 100% with the recommendations that the Charter Board brought before the Council. He said the Boards do not have to agree with one another but there is much work that has to be done. Mayor Abramowitz said his personal feeling is that he would hate to sit down and review the Charter. He said he would want the members of the Charter Board to do all the work and then to advise him that there are problems and get their suggestions on how best to alleviate them. Mayor Abramowitz said the Charter Board feels that the Council is taking away its rights to be able to do what the Charter says. Mayor Abramowitz said experts have advised there can only be one legislative body in the City. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said she agrees there is one legislative body in the City and the past Charter agreed with the same concept. She said the purpose of the meeting goes back to the joint meetings in an attempt to change some amendments. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said the Board attempted to change the Charter jointly with Council regarding the amendment to change terms of office of members. She said there was disagreement at most of the meetings but amendments were prepared in which the Council and the Board made compromises. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said the Resolution which was placed on the ballot was not the one both Council and the Charter Board agreed upon. For the record, Councilwoman Diane Glasser joined the meeting already in progress and Mayor Abramowitz advised Councilwoman Glasser what transpired prior to her coming into the meeting. Mayor Abramowitz stated that the facts presented by Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd were not factual. He referred to the Minutes of the Joint Council Meeting in question and noted that it was decided at that par- ticular time how long the terms of office would be presented. He said it had not been determined that people sitting in office at that time could run. After discussion, there was joint agreement with this statement. Mayor Abramowitz read verbatim Minutes from that Meeting and highlighted what he felt was applicable. He said there was never anything or anyone at the table who said the referendum should exclude an individual who sat in office at that particular moment. He said it referred specifically to Charter Board and Council. Mayor Abramowitz said it was determined that as soon as the Mayor received the language on the referendum, the Charter Board Chairman would have it. He said that both received the language at the same time, at the same Council meeting. Mayor Abramowitz said that Stan Bernard, Chairman of Charter Board at that time, indicated what was meant was that anyone who is in office can now run for another term. He said at that time, no one from Council or Charter Board said anything about excluding people sitting in office. Mayor Abramowitz said he would not accept anyone saying they said one thing but meant another. Mayor Abramowitz referred to that Meeting and said that the public would not understand the wording. He said the residents have to make the choice. He said some members of Council felt the same way -unlimited terms. He said he was in agreement with what Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said and voted for it. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 4 Mr. Feldman asked Mayor Abramowitz about the Minutes and reiterated that the Mayor had told the Charter Board at that time, that the minute the language came down, it would be given to the Charter Board for their review. He said it was not given to the Charter Board for review but brought up at the Council Meeting and voted upon at the same Council Meeting. He stated the Charter Board never got a chance to look at it. Mayor Abramowitz said he told Chairman Bernard that the moment the Mayor had the language, the Charter Board would get it. He said Mr. Bernard was standing next to the Mayor and, when the Attorney brought down the language, a copy was given to him. Mayor Abramowitz was asked by Mr. Feldman why this item was on the agenda to be voted upon and Mayor Abramowitz answered that it was not his doing. Mayor Abramowitz said another question raised by Mr. Feldman was when the Mayor got up to speak, he always said there has to be only one legislative body. He said Mr. Feldman challenged the Mayor to show where the Charter Board challenged whether there should be one legislative body or two. He said the Board never questioned that statement. Chairwoman Davis said with the amendments voted upon in September, the Charter Board had many workshops and it was discussed then. She said in their discussions, the Charter Board never meant incumbents but the new incoming officers. She said Mayor Abramowitz was correct in stating it was not mentioned and added the Charter Board had a workshop that morning and mentioned it, however, it was forgotten. She said she admitted that a mistake was made. She said at the Council Meeting later that day, members of the Charter Board indicated they wanted it changed, but that it was too late to be changed. Mayor Abramowitz wanted Ms. Davis to explain what she meant by that. He added that it could not be taken off the referendum ballot at that time. He said if it were taken off, the deadline would have passed. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd stated that the Charter Board requested to see the actual legal wording, the adding of the statement regarding the incumbents and, as soon as they saw it, it came as a total surprise to them. She said it had never come up. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd asked since it had never been addressed, why was it part of the "legalese". Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd further asked for the wording to be withdrawn and the Charter Board was told there was not enough time. Mayor Abramowitz said that was not what she was told. He said once it was removed, it could not be put on the ballot. Chairwoman Davis requested their Attorney Gabriel speak with Attorney Ruf to see if a compromise could be reached and if something could be changed. She said she spoke to Attorney Ruf at a Council Meeting and asked him the same question about something being changed. She said Attorney Ruf indicated that no agreement had been reached. She said he said things would stand if it were to go on the September 4, 1990 ballot. She said the residents wanted it the way it turned out. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 5 Chairwoman Davis said Charter Board Members feel there is only one legislative body but Chairwoman Davis wants to know why the Council feels the Board is usurping its power of putting amendments on the ballot if they are only proposing the amendments. Mayor Abramowitz responded that in all the time he has been with the City, he has never heard one person object to proposing amendments. He said he feels the problem is that the Charter Board feels they have the right to bypass the City Council. Mayor Abramowitz said he wanted someone to show him, from any set of minutes, where the City Council objected to the Charter Board making a proposal. He said in the past there were some problems with the wording but the problems were discussed and the problem was solved. Mayor Abramowitz said State Law stipulates that it is the obligation of the City Council to propose, enact and pass legislation. Chairwoman Davis said she had concurred with the Mayor's statement that the Charter Board can propose changes. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd wanted clarification of whether the Mayor meant proposals going before Council or proposals to go directly to referendum. Mayor Abramowitz responded that Ms. Kitograd's statement was incorrect. He said he means that the Charter Board's function is to go through the Charter, come up with changes, etc., and discuss them with Council. He said they can then advise Council that there are problems and they would like to make a proposal. Chairwoman Davis reiterated the Mayor's statement and wanted to know why the Council did not agree with the proposals made last December. She said she referred to the four amendments. Mayor Abramowitz advised that when the Council and the Charter Board met, it was a very vocal and loud meeting with nothing being accomplished. Mayor Abramowitz said the Charter Board has a function they can perform. Councilwoman Glasser asked if the Charter Board had met with the City Council. Chairwoman Davis and Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd both responded affirmatively saying that a Joint Workshop Meeting had taken place between City Council and the Charter Board. Ms. Davis said that four proposals were presented and nothing happened. Chairwoman Davis said what the Mayor is proposing sounds fine, however, the Charter Board is being asked to spend many hours reviewing the four proposals ready. She said the Charter Board does not have any problem with this, except those hours would be wasted because the only progress which might take place would be done through a Joint meeting, and nothing else. She said if a Charter Board Meeting takes place and it is not a Joint Meeting, chances are the amendments can probably be disposed of. Mayor Abramowitz responded to the Vice-Chairwoman's comments by stating that with regard to the four amendments, Council disagreed with of the four. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 6 Mayor Abramowitz said because there are new Council and Charter Board Members, there is hope that some of the problems can be eliminated. Mayor Abramowitz said the first Joint Meeting between Council and the Charter Board resulted in some opposition from the other Council Members. Mayor Abramowitz said he feels that if the Charter Board recognizes what their duties are and at the same time the Council understands that there will not be anything political about it, than Council would be most happy to meet with the Charter Board to come up with recommendations. Tape Councilman Katz said some of the Charter Board's recommendations 2 were not even realistic or legal. His suggestion was to review what had previously been recommended and then bring it to Council. He said the recommendations which had previously been rejected should again be reviewed and should now be compared to the objections raised by the Council. He said in this way, there may be a chance the Council and the Charter Board can see eye-to-eye. Chairwoman Davis and Mayor Abramowitz said they are in agreement with Councilman Katz's suggestion. Chairwoman Davis said if there are constructive changes and proposals made, would the procedures designated by Council be followed. Mayor Abramowitz asked if the Charter Board would object if the Council rejects the proposals because they are not in agreement with them. Chairwoman Davis wanted to know if the proposal could be put on the ballot anyway. Councilman Katz responded that the Charter Board would again make changes and those changes would be presented to Council. He stated for the record that this was not the first Joint Meeting he attended between the Council and the Charter Board. He said he noted that opinions cannot be forced upon anyone and that the Board can make recommendations to the Council and then discussions can take place for an ultimate agreement to take place. Mayor Abramowitz said although the proposals were made as many as six times, what the Chairman said is what the Charter Board wants. He said if the Charter Board offers a proposal and it is not accepted by the Council, then they want to put it on the referendum anyway. Councilman Katz said there should be a reason why Council does not agree with what the Charter Board is suggesting. He wanted to know if their reasoning is sound or is it unsound. He asked if it is unreasonable, can it be amended and a compromise be made. Mayor Abramowitz wanted to know what happens if there is no agreement; if what is presented still cannot be agreed upon, should it be taken further. He added that the law says that the legislative body in the City has the responsibility of proposing, enacting, and placing the laws of the City. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said she is in agreement with the Chairwoman but she added that the Charter Board needs to change the Charter because when there is disagreement, it gives the Charter Board the right to go directly to the residents. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said at past Charter Board meetings, discussions have been held relating to the absolute duties and functions of the Charter Board. She said she feels this can only be done at Joint Workshop Meetings. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 7 Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd added that the Mayor sees the Charter Board as a body giving amendments the Council is having problems with and the Charter Board can work on that. She said she does not agree with that statement but nothing is defined under the functions of the Charter Board. She said this is a primary concern. Vice-Mayor Bender stated that he believes the word "respect" means to respect the elective office or position regardless of who fills the position. He said no progress can be made if the Council and the Charter Board constantly argue the same old problems over and over. He added that establishing priorities of what has to be accomplished should be one of the primary goals. Vice-Mayor Bender said whatever decisions are made with regard to putting referendums on the ballot must be good for the City and not for one legislative body or the other. Mr. Krantz agreed with Vice-Mayor Bender in that the City should go forward and not look back on what happened in the past. Mayor Abramowitz said the Charter Board was asked to go through the proposals recommended by Carla Coleman and to make a list of priorities. He said the Council did the same thing. He said the first set of amendments came out in the order of importance by both Council and the Charter Board. He said there were several meetings after that and priorities were set again. Mayor Abramowitz said at the joint meetings, the proposals made by Carla Coleman were again reviewed and again priorities were established. He said Council requested the Charter Board submit their priorities and establish a priority list from both bodies. Mayor Abramowitz said he would like to meet again and review the Charter Board's amendments by listening to the tape, correcting the problem and establishing a priority system. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd reiterated the Charter Board's first priority is to deal with the amendment which defines the function and duties of the Charter Board. She said the Charter Board does not wish to address any other amendment until that time. Mayor Abramowitz said that should be the primary priority. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd agreed that this is the first priority. Chairwoman Davis concurred and added that before any articles are corrected, proper time should be allocated for this purpose. Vice-Mayor Bender noted that Ms. Coleman's recommendations fall into two classifications: one deals with legislation and the other deals with housekeeping or administrative. Vice-Mayor Bender said administrative recommendations are greater. He said that much can be dealt with in this classification. Vice-Mayor Bender said legislation is Ms. Coleman's first priority. He said it will probably take a little while longer to clean up this priority. Vice-Mayor Bender said he reviewed whatever was legislative and whatever was administrative and by separating the two, he believes it will be easier to tidy up the Charter Board. He said it would Probably be longer for the legislative portion. Mayor Abramowitz mentioned to Councilman Katz and Councilwoman Glasser that he went by the list the last Council had prioritized and established and these Council persons do not have to agree with those priorities. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 8 Councilman Katz said he did not agree with Ms. Kitograd's suggestion as far as having joint meetings. He said a joint meeting should be held only to review recommendations the Charter Board has already made and are ready to bring before Council. Councilman Katz said the Charter Board's function is not to work on the recommendations made by Ms. Coleman but to work on the Charter itself. He said if Ms. Coleman's recommendations are to be used as guidelines, than her intent was correct. Vice-Mayor Bender commented that Ms. Coleman is quite knowledgeable and made a list of all the State laws and Statutes. He said she named the laws the Board can refer to. He said Ms. Coleman saved the Board many hours of research. Discussion was held and comment made by Chairwoman Davis that Ms. Coleman's recommendation was to do away with the Charter Board. Vice-Chairwoman Kitograd said for the record that if anyone reviews the minutes of the Charter Board meetings, they will read Ms. Coleman's recommendations and the validity of that statement. She asked if the Charter Board should be an elected or appointed body. She said some members feel Ms. Coleman's recommendations should be discussed more fully. Mayor Abramowitz said there were a number of recommendations that both the Council and the Charter Board were in disagreement with and he was quite displeased with the recommendation she made regarding the City Manager. Councilwoman Glasser said she was familiar only with what she read in the newspapers. Vice-Mayor Bender said that Ms. Coleman made an observation based on her review of the Statutes of other municipalities. Mayor Abramowitz said the fact that there are two elected bodies in the City of Tamarac leads to confusion and other problems. Vice-Mayor Bender stated one other City, Pembroke Pines, does have a Charter Board and elects the members. Mr. Krantz said that in the earlier portion of the meeting, one of the problems mentioned was lack of information. He asked if it were possible for the Charter Board members to get copies of the Council meetings. Vice-Mayor Bender requested the City Manager make sure that the Charter Board is on the distribution list. Mayor Abramowitz said he will go through his recommendations again and will write down what he feels are priorities and then he will send them to Chairwoman Davis for discussion and consideration. He suggested the Charter Board do the same thing. He added that the Charter Board did not have to agree with what he prioritizes but this is a guide. He said when the Charter Board feels that they have a priority list, then a joint meeting can be scheduled to discuss the lists. He said he is in agreement with Councilman Katz's suggestion. Chairwoman Davis said their first priority is to establish procedures. Mr. Winter said he felt the Charter Board had not been reviewed for many years. Mayor Abramowitz said a copy of Ms. Coleman's recommendations can be obtained from the City Clerk's Office. City Council and Charter Board Joint Workshop Meeting 4/25/91/PP PAGE 9 Ms. Melanie Reynolds, resident, said that since 1986, there has not been a Charter Board who has carried out their duties. She said the Board meets once a month. She said Ms. Coleman is not as qualified as others. Ms. Reynolds said when the Board asked for minutes in 1979, all the Ordinances and Resolutions were given to the Charter Board. She said in 1983 and 1984, the Board got its first office and received all minutes of all prior meetings, State Statutes, Code and everything they needed and she feels the current Board is not utilizing them and has not done anything since 1986. With no further business, the Mayor ADJOURNED this meeting. Carol Evans City Clerk "This public document was promulgated at a cost of $120.14 or $7.07 per copy to inform the general public, public officers and employees of recent opinions and considerations of the City Council and Charter Board of the City of Tamarac". ~� ��/��N��p�� 2 4 �� " : V �� , I c e & ( n p � � v x 9 ; � � � � ~ � � � � \ ^ � � � � . 0 �� } � � � � � � � � % ' ? 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